lotrsam0711
Registered: 01/21/09
Posts: 3
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| Posted 01/21/09 at 10:29 AM | Reply with quote #26 |
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I signed up in order to take part in this club so hello all.
If I remember correctly this will be my third playthrough. About 3 years ago I bought this game and played through it a couple of times since then. It's easily one of my favorite games and I'm interested to see what newcomers think about it. I'm also looking forward to seeing if it withstands the test of time.
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Tharron
Registered: 01/21/09
Posts: 1
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| Posted 01/21/09 at 11:46 AM | Reply with quote #27 |
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Well ive decided that im going to join the Vitage Game Club and i have by coincidence this game laying around never installed it tough but played it on the GameCube will see if it works on my computer (its not really a good one) and ill prolly join if it runs ok 
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oliemoon
Registered: 10/18/08
Posts: 5
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| Posted 01/21/09 at 01:21 PM | Reply with quote #28 |
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Being new to BG&E, I am most excited about playing as Jade. As one of the few WOC (woman of color) protagonists in gaming, and one who is not treated as a sex object at that, she is really highly regarded amongst all of my feminist gamer friends and I have felt a little bit ashamed of myself over the years for having never played the game.
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CrashT
Registered: 08/19/08
Posts: 327
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| Posted 01/21/09 at 02:30 PM | Reply with quote #29 |
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Quote: Originally Posted by ILR
Another source for audio/video sync issues may be a multicore CPU, which the game is not able to utilize correctly. To set the game to run on a single core on windows XP:
- go to task manager (alt-ctrl-del)
- open Processes tab
- right-click bge.exe
- select Set Affinity
* This opens up a dialog with all the CPU units listed (two for dual, four for quad) where you can uncheck every core except one.
On Vista, I don't know how to do this. The Task Manager has stayed roughly the same for many Windows iterations, so I'd imagine the process to be roughly similar
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sharc
Registered: 10/24/08
Posts: 81
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| Posted 01/21/09 at 04:50 PM | Reply with quote #30 |
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honestly, jade (woman of color? really?) always felt like a pretty vanilla character to me. it's kind of sad that the absence of t&a alone is so noteworthy as to make such an impression on people, but there you go, i guess.
reads like: well if it's not directly relevant to me then i guess it's not important to anyone else
it will be nice to replay without feeling the obligation to get all the geegaws as i go. can anyone remember if there was any reason to get all the pearls? i mean, other than bragging rights? i think there were purposely more than you ever actually needed, which is a nice touch.
Quote: Originally Posted by andrewarmstrong
You seriously think that with such great tracks like Mammago's Garage and Akuda House Propaganda in there?
oh hell, i forgot how awesome this game's music is. seriously looking forward to that.
Quote: Originally Posted by lotrsam0711
If I remember correctly this will be my third playthrough. About 3 years ago I bought this game and played through it a couple of times since then. It's easily one of my favorite games and I'm interested to see what newcomers think about it.
well if you don't finish it this time around you may as well get back TO YOUR KNITTIIIIIIINNNG
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penguindeath
Registered: 11/07/08
Posts: 44
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| Posted 01/21/09 at 06:22 PM | Reply with quote #31 |
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Quote: Originally Posted by sharc
honestly, jade (woman of color? really?) always felt like a pretty vanilla character to me. it's kind of sad that the absence of t&a alone is so noteworthy as to make such an impression on people, but there you go, i guess.
the allegorical ambiguity in the first sentence is making my head spin... woman of color really? vanilla?? i have yet to play the game, is the protagonist "vanilla" because she doesn't behave in a stereotypical "woman of color" way?
and yea it is definitely Very sad that the absence of t&a alone is so noteworthy. for the most part i'm ashamed to admit to people that i'm a gamer, because of the rampant sexism featured in many high-profile games.
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sharc
Registered: 10/24/08
Posts: 81
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| Posted 01/21/09 at 07:15 PM | Reply with quote #32 |
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heh. didn't even consider that interpretation; the vanilla comment refers only to her relatively standard protagonist disposition! although it's news to me if she was supposed to be any particular ethnicity other than Generic Videogame White Person.
reads like: i've never had trouble finding good characters of my gender or ethnicity and i take that for granted, so for some mysterious reason i miss the full significance of the topic
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brinstar
Registered: 10/17/08
Posts: 6
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| Posted 01/21/09 at 09:09 PM | Reply with quote #33 |
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Quote: Originally Posted by sharc
honestly, jade (woman of color? really?) always felt like a pretty vanilla character to me. it's kind of sad that the absence of t&a alone is so noteworthy as to make such an impression on people, but there you go, i guess.
Quote: Originally Posted by sharc
heh. didn't even consider that interpretation; the vanilla comment refers only to her relatively standard protagonist disposition! although it's news to me if she was supposed to be any particular ethnicity other than Generic Videogame White Person.
Jade is considered a woman of colour to many gamers, if you disagree, then perhaps you should debate it, rather than offhandedly dismissing another person's perspective. If it's "news" to you, if it's a surprise, then maybe you should question why this is news to you, why it's surprising, and why you think Jade is white, but other people don't.
Jade isn't a "vanilla" character precisely because her character design and personality eschews so many of the stereotypes that female leads are burdened with. It's not simply the absence of "T&A" that makes Jade noteworthy. Dig a little deeper. Check out Corvus's list of strong female videogame characters. Only 24 women meet the criteria and are on that list, and Jade is one of them. Jade is hardly a "relatively standard protagonist".
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StolenName
Registered: 08/26/08
Posts: 34
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| Posted 01/21/09 at 09:32 PM | Reply with quote #34 |
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Thanks a bunch for the many links to help get the game running smoothly. I'll have to try them tonight. However, I'm still keen to pick up a copy for the PS2 just to see how they compare.
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Twyst
Registered: 01/20/09
Posts: 3
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| Posted 01/21/09 at 09:36 PM | Reply with quote #35 |
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I'm really looking forward to playing as Jade as well. I have heard of this game for soooo long, when i saw it, i bought it, but never played it -- and this is an excellent reason to do so.
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Eleniel
Registered: 01/20/09
Posts: 3
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| Posted 01/21/09 at 11:35 PM | Reply with quote #36 |
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I always thought Jade was Latina.
As far as I recall, the game doesn't spell out Jade's character and personality for you; but it definitely comes through in things like where she lives (a lighthouse where she takes care of orphaned children) and through her relationships and conversations with the other characters, especially Pey'j.
I love this game to death and I'm super excited to play it again. I've built it up so much in my head since I played it that it'll be interesting to see if and how it measures up to what I remember--or think I remember!
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Bus
Registered: 08/26/08
Posts: 164
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 02:42 AM | Reply with quote #37 |
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Isn't it interesting though that she's a woman of color AND a vanilla character? Her race or ethnicity are really incidental to her character as a whole. She wasn't chosen to be black because Michael Ancel wanted to make a story about a single mom raising her kids against all odds because her husband went to jail for dealing crack. No, he held that back for the inevitable sequel: "Beyond Good & Evil 2: Big Pey'j's House."
In all seriousness, there's a school of thought that says to commission a black character in any medium that doesn't have some awareness of its blackness is, at best, a waste and, at worst, a true offense. Then, there's another that says the only way to attain equality is to have black characters that don't think of themselves as black first and foremost. Think of the difference between say Denzel Washington's role in American Gangster and Will Smith in any big budget blockbuster he's made. The former character is acutely aware of his place in society and thus takes more pleasure in achieving his awe inspiring levels of success. The latter never gives a moment to think about how the President's a white guy because he's just anxious to get up there and whoop ET's ass. Is one better than the other? Well, yes. American Gangster was better written than Independence Day. What a shock. But who would have ever believed half a century ago that a black actor would be the only actor in history to have eight movies in a row all gross over $100 million? The level of not just acceptance but genuine liking directed towards Smith by a still quite divided nation is kinda inspiring, in a way.
I truly think you need a healthy balance of both types of characters to really create a safe haven in a medium for the members of a race or ethnicity to be accepted, scrutinized, championed, and vilified all in the appropriate allotments. And I think Jade and Alyx fulfill the Will Smith role of people of color in gaming. There's no American Gangster just yet but that's asking a lot.
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bluewyvern
Registered: 01/20/09
Posts: 16
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 04:59 AM | Reply with quote #38 |
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I'm not so sure about that list. You know who else is on it? Lara Croft. Clearly Jade's lack of sexual objectification was not one of the factors considered for her inclusion in that company. While some entries I highly approve of (April Ryan, Kate Walker), others are either nonsensical (Ms. Pac Man?) or rather debatable (Rosella, for one -- I have problems with Roberta Williams in regards to gender issues. If you're interested, I try to get at it in my Phantasmagoria review).
But anyway. I would agree at first glance that Jade is slightly ethnic, not especially defined by her ethnicity, not sexualized, and a strong independent character. Since I've only played a few minutes of the game, what else she may be remains to be seen.
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shoinan
Registered: 01/14/09
Posts: 6
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 06:01 AM | Reply with quote #39 |
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The parameters for consideration for the list make no mention of sexual objectification. I agree that the list is a little odd. For one there are characters from games that haven't been released yet. Also, what's distinguishable about Chel from Portal? I think the list is going to be limited by there being a lack of female protagonists in video games.
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Corvus
Registered: 07/30/08
Posts: 47
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 09:14 AM | Reply with quote #40 |
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For the record, those were simply the characters I was willing to take under consideration for planned further study. Both Ms. Pac-Man and Lara Croft were likely to have been stricken from the final list for two very different reasons.
Jade, regardless of her ethnicity, is far more than a vanilla character. There are a great many things about how her character is presented that make her stand out from the crowd.
Details can wait until the official play-through, of course!
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lotrsam0711
Registered: 01/21/09
Posts: 3
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 10:31 AM | Reply with quote #41 |
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Quote: Originally Posted by sharcQuote: Originally Posted by lotrsam0711
If I remember correctly this will be my third playthrough. About 3 years ago I bought this game and played through it a couple of times since then. It's easily one of my favorite games and I'm interested to see what newcomers think about it. well if you don't finish it this time around you may as well get back TO YOUR KNITTIIIIIIINNNG
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brainygamer
Moderator
Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 524
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 11:11 AM | Reply with quote #42 |
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Quote: Originally Posted by lotrsam0711
I signed up in order to take part in this club so hello all.
If I remember correctly this will be my third playthrough.
Welcome to the VGC, lotrsam0711. Glad you'd decided to join us. Having gamers aboard who are revisiting the game is a helpful way to add substance to the discussion. Enjoy!
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Michael Abbott
Brainy Gamer blog and podcast |
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scarr
Registered: 01/22/09
Posts: 13
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 12:13 PM | Reply with quote #43 |
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Hello all.
I intend to be joining you all in this little adventure. BGE has been on so many lists of great games and I always intend to pick it up and just never have. It's d/ling on steam now and I'm so excited to play.
Cheers.
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AndrewArmstrong
Moderator - Psychonauts
Registered: 07/22/08
Posts: 365
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 01:13 PM | Reply with quote #44 |
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Yeah, Jade is a nice believable (even in a sci-fi world) character, and has some nice cutscenes/conversations/interactions. Hardly a piece of cardboard, a mute, or some insanely cliché character or walking trope which most characters are.
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seed_runner
Registered: 01/04/09
Posts: 3
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 02:12 PM | Reply with quote #45 |
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Quote: Originally Posted by CRCaseyI am new to the VGC so hello to everyone. My name is Cecil and I am a collector of videogames, and sometimes I even get to play them. 
Beyond is one game that I have seen massive amounts of positive comments and in depth writing about. At the time it sounded quite amazing, and for a mid-generation game you still find it referenced to often. I bought the PS2 version over a year ago, but have never played it. To say the least I am looking forward to the play and discussion of it here.
I will be playing it from the PS2 disk on my PS3, I have the 60g with full backwards compatibility so I am hoping there will be no unknown issues with it. I have forgotten most of what I have read about this game, so I will be seeing it from a relatively fresh view.
Are there any known bugs with the PS2 version?
-Cecil
A couple months ago I played Beyond Good and Evil on my ps3 and I got about half way before I stopped, but I didn't encounter any issues while I played it. |
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CrashT
Registered: 08/19/08
Posts: 327
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 03:19 PM | Reply with quote #46 |
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I don't think I ever thought of Jade as white but then I never really thought of her as black, asian, or latino either, she's just Jade... and she's got a pig for an uncle...
Brinstar I'm interesting in hearing about how some others have perceived her ethnicity as there's no explicit reference to it in the game, at least none I can remember.
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Justin Keverne
GamerTag: CrashT
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TheDiscoKing
Registered: 10/20/08
Posts: 14
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 03:30 PM | Reply with quote #47 |
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I must admit, I've only ever sen the box art and screen shots but I've never thought of Jade as black or Latino. maybe I'm just so used to seeing white heroes I just glossed over the whole idea?
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sharc
Registered: 10/24/08
Posts: 81
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 03:40 PM | Reply with quote #48 |
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Quote: Originally Posted by lotrsam0711
I've already beaten the game twice, both times to 100% completion.
Quote: Originally Posted by brinstar
Jade is considered a woman of colour to many gamers, if you disagree, then perhaps you should debate it, rather than offhandedly dismissing another person's perspective. If it's "news" to you, if it's a surprise, then maybe you should question why this is news to you, why it's surprising, and why you think Jade is white, but other people don't.
what i'd like to know is where you get the idea that i disagree or dismiss here. it's an interpretation i did not consider and this thread is the first time i've ever heard mention of the subject. why i didn't consider it? perhaps because most game stories default to a generic white character and will not adopt any other ethnicity without calling as much attention to the fact as possible? because it's uncommon to see the topic handled with anything even resembling tact or subtlety? this is an issue i am so accustomed to hearing screamed out of a megaphone that i am often rendered deaf to the quiet tones of real discussion.
reads like: i'm upset someone pointed that i was acting like an ass so instead of apologizing or saying anything meaningful i'll just get rude and defensive while sidetracking the discussion through a smokescreen
Quote: Originally Posted by brinstarJade isn't a "vanilla" character precisely because her character design and personality eschews so many of the stereotypes that female leads are burdened with. It's not simply the absence of "T&A" that makes Jade noteworthy. Dig a little deeper. Check out Corvus's list of strong female videogame characters. Only 24 women meet the criteria and are on that list, and Jade is one of them. Jade is hardly a "relatively standard protagonist".
allow me to make my views here perfectly clear. a female lead who is consistently well-written, highly competent and not played for sex appeal is not what i consider extraordinary. it is the bare minumum i expect from these characters, the standard that they should all reach. i don't think it's outstanding when this happens; i think it's a failure when this does not happen. on some level, i resent the idea that we should dole out praise for what should already be firmly-established common practice. if you think i'm being unreasonable, maybe you can explain why without using little quotes to show how stupid you think i am.
reads like: hey if i make this smokescreen big enough then i can just pretend i never said anything hurtful to begin with
Quote: Originally Posted by bus
lots of interesting stuff
the kind of post i'd like to make, but am not insightful enough to do. well put.
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CrashT
Registered: 08/19/08
Posts: 327
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 04:09 PM | Reply with quote #49 |
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Quote: Originally Posted by sharc
allow me to make my views here perfectly clear. a female lead who is consistently well-written, highly competent and not played for sex appeal is not what i consider extraordinary. it is the bare minumum i expect from these characters, the standard that they should all reach. i don't think it's outstanding when this happens; i think it's a failure when this does not happen. on some level, i resent the idea that we should dole out praise for what should already be firmly-established common practice. if you think i'm being unreasonable, maybe you can explain why without using little quotes to show how stupid you think i am.
Heh, let's all be cool now.
I agree with your sentiment and I'd imagine\hope that Brinstar does as well. The problem, as you appear to clearly understand, is that most game characters are poorly developed and badly written. Ideally we shouldn't praise something for achieving what should be the bare minimum. Unfortunately the current state of video game characters is far, far from ideal so maybe a little recognition of the times when developers actually do get it right is justified.
Personally I don't like being thanked for doing my job right, I mean it's my job, I should be doing it correctly that's the bare minimum I should be doing. I should only provoke comment when I either excel or I fail. Of course that doesn't stop people thanking me and I guess neither should it really.
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Justin Keverne
GamerTag: CrashT
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brainygamer
Moderator
Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 524
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| Posted 01/22/09 at 04:32 PM | Reply with quote #50 |
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I'm happy to see this discussion of Jade emerging, which I think is inevitable and very useful.
I just want to encourage everyone to let this conversation emerge from our playthrough, rather than spilling too much of it out before some players have had a chance to form any of their own impressions.
I'm not trying to squelch vigorous discussion, just focus it in threads where it can be most useful. It's always tricky when players who know a game mix it up with players who don't, but in the past we've been pretty successful making this work by organizing comments in such a way as to allow people to discover the game at their own pace.
Maybe it would be helpful to begin a "thoughts on Jade" or "thoughts on female protagonists" thread at some point after we begin our playthrough, if people wish to extend their comments beyond the parameters of the game itself.
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Michael Abbott
Brainy Gamer blog and podcast |
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