AndrewArmstrong
Moderator - Psychonauts
Registered: 07/22/08
Posts: 365
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Posted 05/10/10 at 07:11 AM
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#1
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The camp! You start here (at the bunk area) before going to the first level, and get to explore the rest of it after the initial training levels. A part of the game is also dedicated to exploring it in more detail later on, you'll see the thread in the list since it takes a while and can be considered its own level.
It also changes after each level is completed, with the campers going around doing stuff, so explore readily and talk to everyone! 
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Kloreep
Registered: 08/04/08
Posts: 294
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Posted 05/12/10 at 05:36 PM
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#2
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Returning to the game, I'm again impressed by the effort put into the camp. Aside from all the short cutscenes and the frequency with which they're refreshed, there are little details that have a lot stuffed into them as well. I was standing in front of one of the message boards for several minutes having Raz read off postings and I don't think I managed to exhaust the available lines.
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Rowan
Moderator
Registered: 04/23/10
Posts: 305
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Posted 05/14/10 at 01:15 AM
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#3
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extremely vague spoilers ahead. You know, if any forum needed spoiler tags....
I loved this part the first time I played. In a sense, I think the most I liked Psychonauts was right after the first level, when the camp is open and there's people to talk to, but before the big plot kicked in. I got the feeling that the point of the game was to deal with the other campers, maybe find something bigger soon, but it was going to be within Wispering Rock. It oozed all kinds of potential.
As the plot unfolded, and the game left the campers behind, I found much of what came admirable, particularly from an artistic design sense, but not quite as exciting from a plot sense. Much of the potential was fulfilled, but in terms of plot and character, I was disappointed. I guess we'll see if I feel the same way four years later.
vague spoilers concluded
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AndrewArmstrong
Moderator - Psychonauts
Registered: 07/22/08
Posts: 365
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Posted 05/14/10 at 02:46 PM
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#4
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I liked how the camp is introduced - the intro is amazingly short for how much info and fun it contains. You immediately get what the game is about.
You do end up a bit disorientated though, so not leaping directly into a tutorial is good - controls at the start are easy to get, and you immediately get things to interact with! Squirrels really are evil
The campers - well, I think they fill out nicely if you talk to them, and don't get too much in the way (you're not forced to do a lot with them) or too out of the way (they are accessible in different places for much of the game). They have character, and are characters, but beyond that the relevance is mainly background and in fact they're getting on with their own thing means it's much more involving to see things unfold naturally, even if it is cut off later.
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davidcarlton
Moderator
Registered: 07/15/08
Posts: 548
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Posted 05/15/10 at 04:28 PM
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#5
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I thought it was interesting how the art style for Raz's face was so different from the other characters: the others were more cartoony, his was more strangely adult.
I've been enjoying just wandering around this area. Nice that, for people like me who don't like leaving anything undone or going to a level too many times, that I can get the cobweb duster before getting too far along in the levels. Though I do think I am going to eventually hit collection overload in this game...
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Kloreep
Registered: 08/04/08
Posts: 294
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Posted 05/15/10 at 05:05 PM
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#6
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Fun side detail: if you get tired of simply following story progression, take the Crow Feather you acquire early on (can't honestly remember where) and go around tickling people with it.
Quote: Originally Posted by davidcarlton
Though I do think I am going to eventually hit collection overload in this game...
I dislike the overabundance of collectibles. They could have done much more with less, I think. When I can get figments or cards simply by following the path I would have anyway, it cheapens the reward when I also get one by going out of my way and completing a jumping/power puzzle.
Hasn't kept me from falling straight into completionist OCD, though.
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AndrewArmstrong
Moderator - Psychonauts
Registered: 07/22/08
Posts: 365
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Posted 05/15/10 at 05:34 PM
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#7
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I didn't really do much intentional collecting during my first playthrough. Having seen the rewards list after I finished it, I didn't care much either
It does have an over-abundance, which is good because it means you don't need to collect everything, unlike a lot of other games which basically force you to.
However, the mandatory collecting part later in the game is a bit of a bummer. Fetch quests, meh!
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baf
Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 25
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Posted 05/16/10 at 03:57 PM
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#8
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One thing I didn't fully appreciate my first time through: There's a lot going on at the camp. If you just go where you're told to go and do what you're told to do, you'll miss out on a lot of optional story about the other kids -- and past a certain point, it all becomes unavailable. (You'll know when that happens.) So really, take the time to wander around and look at things and talk to people. When major plot events occur, wander around and see what's changed. As an added bonus, you'll tend to find more arrowheads and the like that way.
Also, you can read the bulletin boards, and the content changes over time.
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ILR
Registered: 08/27/08
Posts: 140
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Posted 05/17/10 at 12:57 PM
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#9
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The amount of different collectibles is simply overwhelming in this game. It's my second time playing Psychonauts, so I'm actually familiar with this stuff but, still... ugh. It's interesting to compare this extravaganza to the economy of Another World's expression.
The first time playing this game was naturally even worse. Before the game even begins, an unidentified old man lectures me about some psi-markers and cores in the middle of a... Tutorial for Looking Around(?). In the first psi-scene the figments are introduced, so are the film reels, emotional baggage, and even cobwebs that the player has no access until later. When you get back outside, the scavenger hunt announcement booms at the camp PA. When you try to leave the area, the two girls want you to start collecting arrowheads. This is well beyond ludicrous.
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baf
Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 25
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Posted 05/17/10 at 04:19 PM
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#10
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It isn't so much a tutorial for looking around as a calibration -- it tells you to look left and then look up, and remembers what direction you intuitively moved the joystick or mouse on hearing these commands. (Yes, some people have intuitions that are the opposite of yours.) I've seen other games that do this, but they're usually subtler about it and work it in more smoothly. I'm guessing this was a late addition to the game.
Also, re collectibles: I know I'm in the minority here, but, compulsive collector that I am, I actually liked them. Or at least, I did once I understood that it's not nearly as complicated as it all seems. All collectibles ultimately do the same thing: directly or indirectly, they increase your Rank. This is the funnel that all upgrades flow though. (Arrowheads are arguably an exception to this, because you can spend them on stuff that doesn't have anything to do with rank. But really, the main use for arrowheads in the game is buying psi-challenge cores.) The different forms of collectible just provide different flavors of collection, and reward different sorts of exploration. Psi cards, scattered around in any moderately off-the-path spots, reward thoroughness. Psi-challenge markers are a special reward for reaching hard-to-reach places. Scavenger hunt items are about solving special optional puzzles. Figments are as plentiful as pac-man dots, and serve to reinforce the sense of where you have and haven't been. And so forth.
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Rowan
Moderator
Registered: 04/23/10
Posts: 305
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Posted 05/17/10 at 04:27 PM
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#11
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I think the Pac-Man dots is a good analogy. The collection in the game is so ubiquitous as to not be an overload so much as just background in the game. Everywhere you step there's something to collect. If you want to try really hard, there's more, but it's not necessary.
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oozo
Moderator - Another World
Registered: 03/04/09
Posts: 95
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Posted 05/19/10 at 12:01 PM
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#12
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A bit late to the game, but here are my thoughts (they are not specifically related to one thread, hope it's ok when I post them here):
I was surprised to almost instantly find myself playing the game in the same way I played all the adventures Schafer was involved with back in the day. In the very old days, I didn't own a computer myself, so I mostly experienced the first 2 Monkey Island-games as an eye-witness while my friends where playing it - or better put: I was a semi-passive contributor to what was going on, shouting my own ideas, but never actually in control. I experienced it as some sort of presentation, not really as a game.
I guess that influenced my play-style once I actually got a computer and around to play Day of The Tentacle or Monkey Island 3 (which is not technically a Schafer-game, but let's not go into details): I did not really care too much about solving riddles, I enjoyed myself much more just walking around, klicking on stuff, discovering rooms and spaces and people and dialogs. I never felt bad about using a walk through when I got stuck - I was in it for the writing, the story, the game world, not for the challenge. (Which is hardly a surprising perspective; I mean, if there's one genre that hasn't evolved at all in regard of it's mechanics, it's the point and click-adventure; it's thousand of different stories, all told with the same tools.)
Psychonauts is my first non-adventure Schafer-game; I had read enough about it and Brütal: Legend to not really be surprised by the fact that it shines first and foremost in just that aspects I loved about adventures, and is not that remarkable otherwise. I was surprised, though, to find out that I did not care at all.
Maybe this will still change, but so far, the game really knows its strengths: It is so very forgiving in the action sequences - I have finished the first 3 "levels" and still haven't lost a life (or astral projection). I love it for this. As people have already pointed out, Raz really moves gracefully, it's a pleasure to control him, and I wouldn't want it to become a chore. (Hope the rest of the game won't change that...)
I had played the demo of the game before, but I never really warmed up to it - and I guess I know why now. It's really the camp where the game find itself, where it turns into a playground in which you can play hide and seek with all the lovely details the team has put into it.
I could really see the IP made into a cartoon with limited run (about 14 episodes would be perfect), so I'm not sure if the explorational aspect is really crucial to the game - but it makes it worthwhile.
Oh, and I really, really loved all the Ford Crullers of the camp - as he showed up for the first time attracted by the bacon, I laughed harder than probably ever before while playing a game.
We definitely should create a "Your lol-moment"-thread or something... 
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AndrewArmstrong
Moderator - Psychonauts
Registered: 07/22/08
Posts: 365
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Posted 05/20/10 at 03:09 PM
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#13
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I've gone back and yes, am now actually playing the game proper - got delayed with various busy nights!
The collecting - I'm glad it gets it out of the way quickly. The actual bonus stuff you can find (besides figments) in minds are worthwhile, but I quickly just collected what was easy in my first playthrough and do not foresee myself doing much different here. The levels flow a lot better if you simply don't bother trying to be OCD about figments for instance.
The intro is very foreboding in it's own way (but you don't notice it on the first playthrough as much as later ones!), I'll get back to it in another thread. However I want to mention again it was a fun FMV, and you get a good feel for the characters, some checkov's gun-style comments of lake monsters, and the humour is all in the right places. I've got to do another thread on it but the voice acting is downright amazing and reminds me very much of Day of the Tentacle in delivery, pacing and so forth.
I also think that the comment on Raz being ultimately more adult designed is a bit off - Lily is of similar "normalness" along with a few other camp characters, but I meant to say that before - basically, they're all cartoony, and yeah, a cartoon with the same setting would likely work, although it'd lose a lot of nuances the game has (multiple mini subplots, exploration and setting, wide range of cast members and so forth - it might average out as okay though). It's a crucially different medium to split up into chunks so it'd be something entirely different. Videogames might not be the best thing to simply watch for entertainment (although this gets close at times), but it works better for longer plots - this game would be hard pressed to chop up for a cartoon or compress for a film, which is good and something I think is important to note - as it is, there would be a loss if this was made in another medium so we're the better for having it to play!
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